Discussion Forum by JTony Loves Brains
September 14th, 2007 3:16 PM1. I think it should be impossible for tasks to be retired while folks are still signed up to work on them. If a task is earmarked for retirement, a note to those signed up should at least be sent out before hand. The incentive I have to complete the task is very low, now it has been retired, since it is highly unlikely folks will bother to look at it, let alone vote on it (no, I'm not talking about points here, I'm talking about recognition for good, hard work). However, I may have put a great deal of work into the task already and am just not ready to submit the proof yet. Someone should find out if folks are really working on a task or not before shoving it into retirement.
2. There should be a feedback loop for folks who are supposed to guide players through their tasks. Each person who creates a task should be responsible for answering questions about that task, and there could be some sort of system by which it is clearly shown if someone is taking care of their tasks and the players doing them or not. Task creators should be task owners and help make the tasks themselves successful by answering questions, clarifying, etc. Perhaps task ownership points of some kind, with a ranking so that folks signing up for a task know whether or not they've got help or are just on their own?
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No I think that some tasks, regardless of being retired or not, deserve completion. I don't think that the goal should always be FOR THE WIN, but instead just something that you can find joy in doing. Why else would this exist if we didn't enjoy the tasks we complete regardless of the votes.
i think if you signed up for a task, you can still submit it whether its been retired or not. i'm pretty sure campaign trail was retired when i posted it. but i could be wrong.
also i think people sign up for a lot of tasks that don't ever come to be, but a message like you said would solve that if what i said earlier is not the case.
Yeah, lowteck, I'm pretty sure that you are correct, and that you can submit after retirement, provided you've signed up ahead of time (I remember being confused about this when I saw you had posted for campaign trail).
As for whether or not the goal should be FOR THE WIN, I totally agree Eddy. My point is more about exposure than points. When you do something for the love of it, you still want people to see it, and my concern was that, once retired, folks would be less likely to read the Praxis, newly posted or not.
As for the turnover between eras, Darkaardvark, I must admit, I hadn't even thought of it. Of course the whole era change thing is still very confusing to me. (Perhaps the problem is more my own confusion than else).
"Each person who creates a task should be responsible for answering questions about that task" I respectfully disagree, I know that myself and some others make tasks intentionally confusing or ambiguous. This lends to creative interpretation. Task guidance is not necessary because there is no wrong way to do a task
I particularly like that last sentence YellowBear. Thanks. Sometimes I get caught up in making sure I'm following "the" rules and forget it is all just a game of calvinball.
who's on this sight enough to field questions regularly?
There is no wrong way to play SF0!!!
There is only the acclaim or critisicm of your peers to guide you.
But really who gives a fuck what those guys think... NERDS!!!
(and I say this with a smile)...who ISN"T on SFØ regularly?
Hi JTony,
Like Darkaardvark, I don't understand why a retired task completion would get any less attention.
So far, my personal response to seeing a retired task on the praxis has always been one of the following:
- The task was retired so long ago that I've never even heard of it. New things are interesting, so I immediately read both the praxis and the task description.
- The task was recently retired, and it's a task I never particularly liked. In this case, I have no idea it's been retired until I actually read the praxis, so retirement has no effect.
- The task was recently retired and I'm either signed up for it or bitter because I was too stupid to sign up for it before retirement. In this case, it's almost certainly a task I like, and I'm certain to read the praxis.
In any case, it seems like retirement can only help bring in an audience.
The only thing you'll miss out on are people browsing for new tasks and coming across you completion that way. But, I imagine that accounts for a very small fraction of views and votes anyway.
On your second point, adding a "comments on tasks you've created" section to the updates page might be nice. Unless you happen to have befriended someone and it's a slow day, checking for comments on tasks is a tedious business.
Hi Loki,
You said:
"The only thing you'll miss out on are people browsing for new tasks and coming across you completion that way. But, I imagine that accounts for a very small fraction of views and votes anyway."
I think that stated exactly why I posted this as a "problem", and that is, as a fairly new guy here (long time stalker, first time tasker) I have pretty much *only* seen praxis by browsing the task lists. I always forget that newly completed tasks are sitting right there, in the menu on the left, and so wouldn't even notice if a retired task had been completed or not. My assumption (when you make an "assumption" you make an "ass" out of "u" and "mtion") (I don't know why I find that funny) was that others would be doing it the same way, and so I thought views would be missed.
Of course, this is a failure of mine to use the tools given properly. Perhaps there isn't such an issue as I thought. I'm still pondering task ownership, however...
Oh, and I saw Frank Chu yesterday, Malaki. He's now up to something like 28,000 Galaxies (someone tell the bar), and he looks like he gained about 40 lbs. Must be some good eatin' in wasprovenikill.
I'm not sure about most people, but whenever I visit the site I generally take a look at the praxis page and then at my page-with-many-names before doing anything else. So, new completions get seen first. (At least their existence gets seen - sometimes I don't view them all in detail immediately.)
I rather assumed that was what most regulars do - but one can never tell.
I respectfully disagree, I know that myself and some others make tasks intentionally confusing or ambiguous
Read the rest of my comment. (C'mon, I created 'Confuse a Mineral') If there's a misunderstanding of a task that the creator wants to be done in a specific manner, they should be responsible for helping. If they want the task to be ambiguous, then they don't need to offer clarification.
there's a menu on the... Oh, yeah, I see it on the left of the home page. ;-)
Speaking of not using the tools you have, you have noticed this one right?
up at the Top there?
And, there's the lesser noticed, almost-like-they-keep-it-a-secret praxis rss feed
And the double secret tasks and comments panopticon feed shh
The double secret panopticon feed is great.
We may not have Super Sweet Secret abilities unlocked through Score. . . but we certainly do have Super Sweet Secret abilities unlocked through waiting around long enough for someone to mention them.
Thanks!
Oh man I love secrets… Secrets secrets secrets they are so great secret codes, hidden text, secret messages and now a super secret RSS feed that everyone seems to know about! We need some super secret tasks to step this up a notch.
What next in the Paraleisural Game of Freedom and Adventure!!!
God, Schålacø 3000, am I going to have to go back through all your past posts to see what treasures I've missed? If it hand't been for that secret panopticon feed, I'd have never known your secrets.
also this feed appears to contain my true, non-UTF identity:
Ù…Ùردخاي بن يامي٠بن يامين
dude! this made it possible to have sf0 on my google homepage. that means i can read sf0 in secrecy, in safety from the scarier panopticicalities of my employer(s)
xml vos liberabit
Those of us who browse from work in a text browser already know your *real* secret identity: 7 m+'+r+d+x+a+y+ b+n+ y+a+m+y+n+
Which is easily distinguished from Ben, or 5 +n+y+a+m+y+n+ b+n+ y+a+m+y+n+, as he's currently known.
Seriously, a text browser? How is it? We rearranged some styles and sidebars and whatnot a while ago to (in theory) make it easier on lynx and screenreaders, but I hadn't heard of anyone actually using on, yet.
Also - javascript-degrading messages page = (should?) works on your sidekicks, you dorks.
Except for a few of the bits that require javascript, everything works and the layout is excellent. The order of links and fields is great. (At least in elinks. Haven't tried any other text browsers.) It's among the best websites I've seen.
The answer to the obvious question, "why the hell would anyone use a text browser in this day and age?" is that I fairly often find myself with five minutes of waiting time and a nearby shared computer at work. It's rarely the same computer, and five minutes isn't enough time to actually finish reading or writing much. So I leave a gnu-screen session running at home and then ssh in and connect to it from wherever I happen to be. (As a side benefit, I also don't have to worry about nosy sysadmins looking over my shoulder.)
I disagree- the incentive is *higher* to complete retired tasks, not to mention the fact that you can carry them over between eras. Aren't you more likely to look at the praxis if you see someone completed a task you haven't seen in a really long time?
As for (2), I think task creators should be responsible for, every once in a while, clicking through all their tasks and reading any comments. If a comment on interpretation is desperately needed, message them. If they want to leave it vague, that's their choice too.